Liberal arts degrees are largely a waste of time today. One can get the equivalent of a "liberal arts" degree simply through independent study, if you have the discipline and want to broaden yourself. The degree is just a credential to wedge your foot in an employer's door.

Schools, colleges included, must prepare tomorrow's workforce, or they are just expensive luxuries.

This is the applicable Dilbert.

Dilbert's Mom: Your cousin Laurin just got her degree in English. Can you give her some career advice?

Dilbert: Would you enjoy scratching out a meager living in a frustrating work environment?

Laurin: I've never thought about it.

Dilbert: Obviously

I agree. None of the liberal arts classes I took did me any good in the real world. I'm an intern at a hospital in Chicago. It took eight years to get a medical degree. I could've graduated sooner if I didn't have to take so many meaningless classes. It's a long and expensive haul to graduation day as it is.

Obviously if you think Liberal Arts classes are worthless, then don't bother taking them. There are other classes at this university, you know. Or you even just choose not to go to college!

LA classes were originally intended for students who wanted to learn for the sake of learning, and didn't expect college to be nothing but parochial training.

This is really the reason for the decline in American education, as other countries' graduates greatly outperform ours.

These insightful responses really made me think, and in fact spurred me on to another thought. You know what I found worthless as well: all the extraneous math and science courses I've had to take since I was in grade school. I haven't used a single one of them, EVER, other than general math and algebra to balance my checkbook. What a complete waste. I wish the university wouldn't have made me waste time on things like quantitative reasoning, physical and biological sciences, or even that ridiculous ethnic studies requirement. I haven't learned anything from any of those.
It's not like any of those liberal arts courses, social science courses, reasoning or science courses ever provided me with anything. I don't need to think about the world at all, I just need to be able to put a round peg in a round hole at my job (for which I receive a nice petting from the man in the yellow coat!) And all my friend Betsy has to do is push the correct colored lever to receive a yummy food pellet.
Look, you pair of ignorant swine, just because you want to be like labrat, brainless, thumb-twiddling twats, doesn't mean we should encourage it. Surprisingly enough, having an understanding of other people and other things outside of our own little existential bubbles is a useful thing. Oh, but Mr./Ms. First-Poster mentions that one can gain such ideas from independent reading. Sorry, chump, but trying to sound intellegent and being UNORIGINAL by grabbing the ideas right out of Matt Damon's poorly written script doesn't make it so. There is certainly a lot to be learned independently, but what do you think the benefit of having so many focused minds in one place is? I'll let you figure that out. And you, Mr./Ms. Last-Poster, I'm glad that you've got the intellectual abilities of a half-empty can of Natty Light. You proclaim all these classes "worthless." Good for you. I really hope that if I come to you for help as a medical professional, I'll get that very same objective view in your talks with me. That you'll be able to consider the pros and cons of various treatments as well as you've considered the points of your argument here. I would never expect you to look at a malignant growth and just say "Yep, that's a mole," and tell me to go home. Noooo. You've used all those worthless liberal arts courses to really improve your abilities as a thoughtful person.
You may be saying to yourselves, "Awww, but I shouldn't be judged, I just didn't like those courses and didn't see any need for them." WRONG. You are wrong, you are wrong, you are wrong. You are what is wrong with the world. Sweeping generalization? I don't think so. You can't see the value in anything other than your narrowly focused shitty little lives, and you expect everyone else to have the exact same outlook on the world as you. Had you paid attention in those "worthless" liberal arts courses, you might have realized that the world is so much more than the miniscule understanding you have of it.
Honestly, I feel a great, great, great pity for you. You'll earn a wonderful living, marry a wonderful person, and have wonderful everything. BLAH BLAH BLAH. What you're not thinking about now is how wonderfully empty it'll all feel once you've realized that going out to restaurants, banging prostitutes (or your spouse, same difference for you Doc,) and schmoozing swine at the 19th hole hasn't really amounted to shit, and you've got little more than a pile of filth to root around in, like the pigs you are. May your faith in a god and an afterlife be strong in you, because if those aren't there to back up the sudden loss of meaning and the hope and fear of an end you'll experience, you will feel very very sorry for yourselves. You'll come to say, "Well, shiiiiiiit, iffin it don't look like I just got a bunch of stuff wrong, and the meatwagon's a-coming this way." You'll have never experienced the beauty of art, literature, theater, film, language, or history that is so much greater than just Pop advertisements on your wall, Tom Clancy on your bookshelf, Tom Cruise at the box office, English and English only in your brain, and an understanding of American history as the only history, and a history centered around the war programs you've seen on the "History Channel."
So run, pray, hope for yourselves and your families, because if it all turns into nothing and it all feels so foul and cold when you're standing there staring at the imprints you and your spouse have left in the mattress from sleeping in the same spots for 15 years, you might want to at least know that you've experienced a little something more than yourself in your short short life.

I hate to break it to ya, but the primary reason for attending college is to get that slip of paper called a diploma so that we can get jobs. I, like most others, don't have thousands of dollars to spend on a bunch of meaningless liberal arts classes that are not going to help me in the real world. Colleges know this also, which is why most of the required GER classes are liberal arts courses. If they weren't GERs, nobody would take them. Then the schools would have no reason to keep all the crazy, radical liberal teachers that are only there to inflict students with their activist opinions.

"radical liberal"

Haha, there's an oxymoron for ya!

Most of these "crazy lefties" don't teach GER classes. You aren't required to take Social Theory, for example. I dare you to tell me that UW has a bio requirement so a scientist can go on political diatribes.

And half the point of LA classes, after all, is to encourage critical thinking, so that impressionable students can listen to these commie Democrats without being "inflicted with their activist opinions."

"LA classes were originally intended for students who wanted to learn for the sake of learning, and didn't expect college to be nothing but parochial training.
"

At current prices this is only practical for the rich trustifarians.

"At current prices this is only practical for the rich trustifarians."

That's not so much an argument against Liberal Arts as it is against the privitization and exclusivism that state Republicans and the Republicrat governor are striving to complete. If anything, it's a perfect reason for putting the public back in "public education" and treating learning as a basic right, not a privilege for the rich.

What a bunch of ill informed junk responses from the long winded, "I got an art degree and I can appreciate how much effort and thought went into the social commentary of the 20 foot diameter ash tray filled with butts." Notice nobody ever gives an accountant the same leeway on their taxes. "Hey the work you did for me is an ugly heaping pile but I can appreciate how long it must have taken you to add all those numbers wrong."

As for teaching critical thought, that would be nice. However, given the speech code restrictions it is hard to press a Womans or Ethnic Studies professor on how stupid a premise she has introduced when your grade and possible college career hang in the balance. How can students fully grasp an issue when they have to worry about saying something that may offend another perceived group in the classroom. For Example Affirmative Action is reverse discrimination or laws restricting behaviour abound and can not be deemed discriminatory. (Lets see if the critical thinkers can riddle that last bit out)

The problem with Liberal Arts requirements is that it works from the premise that everybody in the room is a stupid hayseed that needs to be programmed to see the world as the intellectual elite see the world. Government fixes problems, individuals and corporations break things.

As for me I learned a few things in my liberal arts classes. Like, Ethnic studies professors believe that once you are classified as a victim that defines you for life. That discussing research on the glass ceiling requires you to finish a presentation by saying despite all evidence pointing to the lack of a secret plot to keep women and minorities out of the boardroom, there must be a plot because the numbers of women and minorities in the boardroom are so small. And whatever you do don't point out that European companies are even worse. I also learned that logical discussion that brings you to a conclusion should be ignored for feelings if your conclusion makes you look or sound conservative. My favorite from a business professor, "It is better to make four employees unhappy by reducing their pay and hours, than it is to fire one person and have three happy employees." Needless to say he didn't win that arguement after I told him to that he could try to embarass me all he wanted and I didn't need to see him after class because he was wrong. Not very suprisingly half the class turned on him until he backed down and changed the answer. Of course if I had been 20 at the time I may not have challenged the little weasel, but I was no longer scanning the room for tail which imboldens most and petrifies the left.

You can like the arts and critize them when the are complete junk.

That last comment was the biggest pile of hoo-ha I've heard in awhile. You too, sir, have not gained an iota of critical thought.

Your first examples were devoid of any real connection to one another, and in total you have not shown anything other than your pig-headed assertion that "Wah wah wah, I'm a white male and I'm sick of being picked on." You do realize that by braying on and on about others' "false victimization," you've in fact now placed yourself in that role of the victim. You see yourself as someone forced to accept others' ways and others' thoughts even when you don't agree with them. Some news for you, YOU DON'T HAVE TO AGREE WITH THEM. That's the whole point. But what you do need is a realistic understanding of why others are what they are, and where they're coming from. If you had even one iota of that, you'd be less apt to blame them for oppressing you (as you claim they do to you,) and be more apt to give a solid argument to support your standpoint. And you haven't.

So, to sum up, what you have learned, sir, is next to nil. You are very sure of yourself and your beliefs, but you have certainly not learned the idea of critical thought. You're critical (oh boy are you critical,) but you've certainly not presented any sort of a well-informed or well-argued point in your rant. Your ramblings about the poor-oppressed conservative are no more than the same canned crap you accuse "women and minorities" of spewing forth.

I hope you'll consider my comments with some sort critical eye, but I suppose you'll probably go off about how I'm the crazy one making the accusations. Think about it for just one second. Please.

The point of liberal arts classes (at least what they told me in private school) is to have something nice to talk about at parties. I don't see anything really wrong with that either.

I would accept your comments if at first you hadn't assumed that I am white, I am not. Although I am a conservative. As for my first comment I am not surprised that you can not see the beauty in numbers. Artists want us to appreciate how difficult and ardous the task even when what the produce is hideous. With numbers we do not give such leeway. We expect all the hard work to produce something that is useful that we can enjoy like a correct answer. Imagine if a person creating codes for the military was only capable of producing something as complex as the Little Orphan Annie decoder ring. She would be fired, but an Artists spills paint on a canvas and I am supposed to pretend that I give a rats ass. Artists, especially those without talent who produce ugly useless crap, want to tell us that we are uneducated and don't have the mental faculty to understand their intent. Which may make them feel better but doesn't change the fact that I can like or not like whatever I want.

As for me I am not a victim never have been. Hell I graduated from one of the Top Public University's in the United States. I don't sit around waiting for somebody else to do for me and mine. That is my job.

I veiw you comments with a jaundice eye because you do not see the connection between art and math. Maybe you would if I said Music and Math making it easier for you to understand how the world around you works. I can appreciate the concept of a Liberal Art education, I can not appreciate what it has become over the last 50 years especially since so many of these supposedly bright people are still trying to champion a communist Utopia. You would think one reading of Animal Farm would cure those oh so bright pencil neck geeks.

I guess the axiom holds true those who can not think critically teach others to think critically. Now either address the points or call me names and tell me I'm ...white some more.

Although I did not attack the writer of the peice it is interesting that you choose to call me out. I find it interesting that you missed the point entirely, most 18-22 year olds do not question or challenge the Dr in the room. When I went to the UW I was over 22 and was paying own way, so I didn't want to waste my time with people who had gotten stuck on stupid. On occassion I went out of my way to rile their feathers and expose them. Just as I occassionally do when posting to the BH.

OK, that still didn't prove anything, sir (or madam, I won't make any more assumptions about you... though your acceptance of a conservative worldview does put you on par with all the white men that are leading you...)
You still haven't provided a logical argument about anything. You claim that artists all "produce ugly useless crap, [and] want to tell us that we are uneducated and don't have the mental faculty to understand their intent." Well, I'm sorry, but you don't apparently have the mental faculties to understand the point of art or literature at all. You claim it all to be useless crap, that you have no time for. That's fine. You don't need to have time for it. But as I mentioned, maybe you should try to see the point in such things. Being dismissive isn't going to help anyone, and not wanting to have a dialogue about it won't either.
Further, comparing it with accounting or finance really doesn't hold water. Would a lawyer and a doctor, both two professionals, like to have their fields compared? No. Even though they're both what you might deem acceptable, professional fields based on things which can be empirically proven, they're still not the same.
It truly appears like you haven't got much out of one those "Top [sic] Public [sic] University's [sic] in the United States." You can't present valid or strongly supported arguments, and your rejections of my points are predicated only upon your own worldview and don't take into account anything but that. You really haven't analyzed the other side of anything, and you appear truly afraid and insecure about your views. By dismissing everything and everyone that isn't like you, you've shown the rational abilities of a child, who will hide or yell or scream when confronted with something it doesn't like. You see, had you (AGAIN!) learned anything while here, you would be able to see the other side of the argument. You claim that you did that in your business class, where you weren't afraid to confront your professor about his/her mistaken ideas. However, it isn't just about telling people they're wrong and that you're right. It's about understanding them. Which you can't do. You're dismissive to the arts, to the humanities, to women, and to minority cultures. You claim that you aren't a victim, but good God, can I say it any clearer: You play the victim so perfectly. "Look at all these people trying to force their ideas on me, trying to make me accept what I don't want to accept. Look at all these women and minorities trying to make me understand that they've been oppressed, when I think they're doing just fine." THAT is what playing a victim is. You may not be one in reality, but you certainly present yourself as one, even though your ideas are in the vast majority right now (Such as: conservative rejection of abortion in South Dakota, conservative fear of the morning after pill as a means of birth control, conservative fear of actually creating a dialogue about Iraq and instead demanding that we either "Stand behind our president or simply show our weakness." I could list more, but all of these things lack one thing: discussion on the part of ultra-conservatives.)
I could go on and on pulling your argument apart, but I'm right. Anyone capable of rational thought (your favorite kind!) can see that my arguments, examples and refutations of your poor logic are correct. Please, I beg you, re-enroll in the university and take the communications and logic courses that you need so badly. Your writing, logic, and argumentation are atrocious, and you seriously need some help with them.
And finally, I can handle conservative thought so long as its presented in a rational, well-argued manner. However, when someone such as yourself presents the filth that I've seen in your last two postings, I find it hard to accept your views. I don't know what you do for a living now, but I hope that you're well-supervised and have someone looking over your work regularly. I'd be very afraid that you'd be one of those "Artists, especially those without talent who produce ugly useless crap, [who] want to tell us that we are uneducated and don't have the mental faculty to understand their intent..." It's clear, after all, that you're not embracing the solid, empirically proven side that you want to be on, and must therefore be an artist (which conclusion I came to using much of the simple logic you want us to embrace.)
Oh, and by the way, if you want to get into a philosophical discussion about these things as well, you should remember that even the math and science (and reality at all!) you purport to be the truth is based on our human acceptance of it. Take that for what you will, but it's been a debate raging for thousands of years. Have a good day, and please, seek the help you need with your reasoning, logic, and writing abilities, and maybe then you'll be able to understand what some of this is all about and what others are saying to you.

So again an epic about me, who you have never meet. I never used the word "all" when discussing art. Since you never attempt to address any of my arguements you are behaving in exactly the manner that you accuse me of behaving. In addition, you add verbage and intent to my words to try and strengthing your attack on me personally which to be honest I find funny.

The concept of being a perpetual learner starts at home not at the UW, and the Liberal Arts degree of my father has been placed by indoctrination by small minded people who, when the can not construct a logical response, stoop to name calling. Although your best shot appears to be the calling of your intellectual betters white or male. Perhaps you just suffer from an inferiorty complex. So now I am an Uncle Tom led by the white decievers. All White Men most think the same way and all Blacks most think the same way or what? Your world view crumbles? Why don't you send your idiotic ramblings to Thomas Sowell and complain about his syntax, and spelling. Unlike pencil neck gecks, I don't rant on the web with a dictionary by my side. Nor do I spend a lot of time trying to change the minds of 20 year olds who will grow up have kids and start voting for conservatives. The smart ones realize what a bunch of misguided crap they swallowed when younger, the others pretend it never happened. The really sad ones are the 50 year olds who still can't figure out why France has a much higher Unemployment rate than the US and they find themselves angry, marching and voting for french looking pretending to be Irish for 30 years presidential candidates.

Two Hydrogen atoms combined with a single oxygen atom make water and that does not require your acceptance or belief. As for Doctors and Lawyers not liking something, what do I care. You may put these folks on a pedastal but I don't. I wouldn't let a risk manager launch a product or concept, which is what a lawyer is. Nor do I have blind faith in Doctors. You should try and work with some you might discover that your health is secondary to their income.

As for what I do, I clearly mention a business course in previous posts something such a great critical thinker like yourself obviously missed. Sometimes things are not shades of gray they are black and white as in the UW doesn't make people learn how to balace a check book. Not part of a liberal arts eductation.